Speaking About Virgins

blackduff · Post by **blackduff** » Wed 27 Jul 2011 16:04

Since everyone on this forum (except Opas) has their arteries blocked after eating the marbled steaks, it's time to change about Virgins. I'm speaking about Extra Virgin Olive Oil. I think we each have our choices and reasons, so let me know is the best to buy or use.

First, does anyone knows why they're "virgin". Okay, we can all check the Wiki but let's have a better answer.

Has anyone been to a place where they grind the olives. What did you find. How many types of olives were included per liter of olive oil. There are green olives, black olives and often reddish/brown olives. Good olive oil will have a specific percentages.

How do you taste the best olive oils?

Where do you buy the best olive oils?

Does Opas buy at Metro for her olive oils?

Is Spanish Olive Oil better than French Olive Oil?

Are there more Virgins in France than Spain??????? (remember the ladies in Jonq. are probably not virgins)

When you put of bread into olive oil, what do you expect to taste?

Blackduff

opas · Post by **opas** » Wed 27 Jul 2011 16:13

I am definatly a virgin

I do not buy my oil at Metro.
Lidl or Aldi are my choice for olive oil, the product suits me and the price is good...about 2 euros 50 per litre.

I have been to the olive oil press places, I have tasted the peppery oils etd, but they are in my opinion not for everyday cooking, especialy as we tend to add lots of fresh herbs or ground spices so I feel the 'expensive 'oils would be lost.

john · Post by **john** » Wed 27 Jul 2011 17:58

I've no intention in getting bogged down in all that price v quality malarkey again, but some cold pressed extra virgin olive oils are incredibly expensive.

There was some article recently that suggested grape nut oil and walnut oil was better for you ,wasn't there?

blackduff · Post by **blackduff** » Wed 27 Jul 2011 18:49

john wrote:I've no intention in getting bogged down in all that price v quality malarkey again, but some cold pressed extra virgin olive oils are incredibly expensive.

There was some article recently that suggested grape nut oil and walnut oil was better for you ,wasn't there?

The Omega 3 is included with walnut oil. Not sure about the grape nut oil.

Blackduff

Sue · Post by **Sue** » Wed 27 Jul 2011 19:04

I have found one I like in Spain and always buy. It makes good dressings and is inexpensive. I very rarely fry with olive oil preferring to use rape seed.

redneckrover · Post by **redneckrover** » Wed 27 Jul 2011 19:41

Some of the celebrity chefs are very positive about Rape Seed Oil , often using it in preference to Extra Virgin olive oil.

Sue · Post by **Sue** » Wed 27 Jul 2011 19:48

Apparently rapeseed oil has the lowest content of saturated fat of any cooking oil and half the amount of saturated fat found in olive oil.

Marguerite & Steve · Post by **Marguerite & Steve** » Wed 27 Jul 2011 21:32

I was always told you don't cook with Extra Virgin oil, it should only be used for dressings or dips, wasted and too expensive to use for cooking.

Sue · Post by **Sue** » Wed 27 Jul 2011 21:40

That takes us back to price and quality again Marguerite as with the steak thread. I buy my extra virgin in Escudero at Jonquera for 3/4€ a litre so it must be a lot lower quality than that at 20/30€ a litre but I happen to like it. I dont use olive oil (virgin or not) for frying because I think it has too strong a taste but I do use it for roasting veg and as you say different types of dressing. Its all down to personal preference.

Rose · Post by **Rose** » Wed 27 Jul 2011 22:35

For my vinaigrette I only ever use huile d'arachide. Have a Delia Smith recipe and would never use another oil. Find olive oil too heavy.

blackduff · Post by **blackduff** » Wed 27 Jul 2011 23:33

I use various oils, depending on the recipes. But, the particular recipe which I'm using tomorrow it says :

PAPAS ALINAS DE CADIZ

The most important thing is to use best quality ingredients -

The best of the olive oil is needed for this recipe and it will taste wrong if it's only a peanut oil.

Often in Spain I would be served a nice slice of fish and then it would have a dollop of virgin olive oil on the top of the fish. Miammm!

I cannot remember use Olive oil for cooking. Normally I use peanut oil for Chinese cooking in the wok. I do use olive oil for salads and cold recipe needs. Often I make a couple of toasts and put sliced tomatoes on top. Then I put salt, pepper, herbs du Provence and finally with mist of olive oil.

Blackduff

Colin L · Post by **Colin L** » Wed 27 Jul 2011 23:50

Olive oil is not great for frying with or roasting potatoes/vegetables because - apart from the flavour not being best for those things as far as I'm concerned - it has a relatively low smoking point and does not crisp things as well as oils such as rapeseed and groundnut do.

Rose · Post by **Rose** » Thu 28 Jul 2011 00:01

Forgot to say huile d'arachide is groundnut oil. It is a good all rounder.

Owens88 · Post by **Owens88** » Thu 28 Jul 2011 01:15

But was Olive Oyl a virgin? Does Popeye know? And where do you buy canned spinach nowadays?

Rose · Post by **Rose** » Thu 28 Jul 2011 02:05

Canned spinach is alive and well in France.

john · Post by **john** » Thu 28 Jul 2011 08:45

Rose wrote:Canned spinach is alive and well in France.

Canned (and bottled )pretty much anything is alive and well in France.

For people who are reputedly the bastions of fine cuisine,it never ceases to amaze me how much tinned stuff they eat.....

We've moved pretty much to walnut oil for salad dressings. Leader Price do a good one.Lovely nutty flavour and without the bitterness associated with so many olive oils. For olive oil,try the offerings from the Co-Op in Capmany,Spain. Quality to price ratio is excellent.

blackduff · Post by **blackduff** » Thu 28 Jul 2011 10:38

I looked in the Lidl flyer for the 3rd of August. There's a special on Maille Olive Oil. I took the flyer but it didn't make it into my car. The price was for two bottles giving a very low price. I think it amounts to around 1.75€ per bottle. Normally the Maille bottles are 75 cl and it's Extra Virgin Olive Oil.

For Spanish food lovers, there are quite some items being presented the 3rd too. Gordal Olives at only 2.19€. Tortilla Patatas; Gazpacho; and many other Spanish specialties.

Blackduff

carol sheridan · Post by **carol sheridan** » Thu 28 Jul 2011 12:12

I thought this was going to be about Richard Branson putting some of his money in Switzerland to avoid tax.

john · Post by **john** » Thu 28 Jul 2011 12:33

carol sheridan wrote:I thought this was going to be about Richard Branson putting some of his money in Switzerland to avoid tax.

I remember just after Branson started his airline, we were flying out of Gatwick with our 7 y.o. son and he spotted one of Branson's shiny new 747s, next to the gate that our plane was departing from.

" Dad.......what actually is a virgin?" he enquired, surrounded as we were with other passengers boarding our Spain-bound flight.

I cannot recall what I answered,but my face went as red as the 747's tail fin !

carol sheridan · Post by **carol sheridan** » Thu 28 Jul 2011 14:45

At my catholic primary school we were constantly told about the Virgin Mary, but when one girl, aged about 10, asked what a virgin was, she was told it was an unmarried woman. The girl then asked how could Mary have a baby if she was not married and was told it was a miracle.

Santiago · Post by **Santiago** » Fri 29 Jul 2011 11:00

We use Lidl's Primadonna olive oil for cooking. I actually use quite a lot of olive oil and very little of the other vegetable oils except sesame.

My feeling is that there is a lot of olive oil around today that is labelled Extra Virgin that isn't. There's more extra virgin on the supermarket shelves than other types, so what happens to all the second pressings?

For dips and salads we buy from Mouiln de la Minerve in Corneilla de la Riviere. They grow and press their own olives and have an interesting range of 4 or five different olive varieties, along with oils flavoured with basil, mint and lemon.

NB: We sell these oils as well as one produced exclusively for us from a small orchard (if that's what you call them) in Ill sur Tet.

Mas St Pierre at Millas has a wonderfully smooth oil and Mas Cantrerrane in Trouillas also makes a lovely oil.

Maille is a good brand but all the branded oils have a bitterness and lack of freshness compared to the estate oils and that makes them less suitable for dishes where the oil is uncooked.

blackduff · Post by **blackduff** » Fri 29 Jul 2011 16:42

I used Maille last night with my "special" spanish potato salad. I used a good Extra Virgin Olive oil previously and the salad was great. Last night's salad was okay but not what I expected.

I just made a vinegrette with a walnut oil which is mixed with rasberry vinegar. This will be used with tomatoes, goat cheese, and walnuts. There will be Mache too. The oil, the walnuts, and the mache are full of Omega 3 (or maybe it's 9) but the flavour is great.

I like to mix the various vinegars too. With a small of effort, a salad can be great.

Blackduff

john · Post by **john** » Fri 29 Jul 2011 17:31

blackduff wrote:I used Maille last night with my "special" spanish potato salad. I used a good Extra Virgin Olive oil previously and the salad was great. Last night's salad was okay but not what I expected.

I just made a vinegrette with a walnut oil which is mixed with rasberry vinegar. This will be used with tomatoes, goat cheese, and walnuts. There will be Mache too. The oil, the walnuts, and the mache are full of Omega 3 (or maybe it's 9) but the flavour is great.

I like to mix the various vinegars too. With a small of effort, a salad can be great.

Blackduff

BD makes a really good point here. I've yet to find one of the expensive so called "estate bottled" olive oils from either France or Spain that warrant the price,especially if you are going to adulterate them with all sorts of vinegars for a salad dressing ,or mint,basil or lemon.

It's the same argument as using top grade single malt whisky and shoving ginger ale or lemonade in it . Or using premier cru champagne to make bucks fizz !

BD's point about salads is also true. If you are going to make one with subtle ingredients the quality of the oil is going to shine through,but very few salads fall into that category,do they ?

blackduff · Post by **blackduff** » Fri 29 Jul 2011 22:29

john wrote:
blackduff wrote:I used Maille last night with my "special" spanish potato salad. I used a good Extra Virgin Olive oil previously and the salad was great. Last night's salad was okay but not what I expected.

I just made a vinegrette with a walnut oil which is mixed with rasberry vinegar. This will be used with tomatoes, goat cheese, and walnuts. There will be Mache too. The oil, the walnuts, and the mache are full of Omega 3 (or maybe it's 9) but the flavour is great.

I like to mix the various vinegars too. With a small of effort, a salad can be great.

Blackduff
BD makes a really good point here. I've yet to find one of the expensive so called "estate bottled" olive oils from either France or Spain that warrant the price,especially if you are going to adulterate them with all sorts of vinegars for a salad dressing ,or mint,basil or lemon.

It's the same argument as using top grade single malt whisky and shoving ginger ale or lemonade in it . Or using premier cru champagne to make bucks fizz !

BD's point about salads is also true. If you are going to make one with subtle ingredients the quality of the oil is going to shine through,but very few salads fall into that category,do they ?

I have to say that the salad at La Table de Cuisine, in St. Andre needs to have good oil since they're serving with the best vinegars around our area. The vinegar is from the place between Port Vendres to Banyuls. I cannot remember their name but I've tried this at the restaurant La Table de Cuisine. This restaurant says that they used the best ingredients for their meals.

Blackduff

john · Post by **john** » Sat 30 Jul 2011 09:10

blackduff wrote:The vinegar is from the place between Port Vendres to Banyuls. I cannot remember their name but I've tried this at the restaurant La Table de Cuisine. This restaurant says that they used the best ingredients for their meals.

Blackduff

I'm sure that's right, BD,though I've yet to come across a restaurant that claims it uses the worst ingredients !

My point about salad dressings is that whatever quality vinegar you use,it's a very strong overwhelming taste,and there is no point whatever in paying big money for a subtle olive oil,as the fragrancy will be totally masked.

Colin L · Post by **Colin L** » Sat 30 Jul 2011 09:51

I must confess the concept of Extra Virgin has always bothered me. It brings to mind some kind of grimly virtuous spinster aunt.

Not that all spinsters are necessarily that virtuous, judging by my mother's observation on the death of an elderly spinster, well known in the parish. "Well," says my mother, "I don't suppose she died wondering."

And back to topic. If the vinegar in a dressing kills the subtle flavours of the oil, that's the fault of whoever made up the dressing for putting in too much vinegar. It should be possible to get the balance right where the flavour of the oil is complemented by the sharpness of the vinegar. Then the quality of the oil comes through and is worth the expense.

That being pretentiously said, I usually just slosh in ordinary enough virgin oil from Lidl

john · Post by **john** » Sat 30 Jul 2011 10:51

Colin L wrote:

It should be possible to get the balance right where the flavour of the oil is complemented by the sharpness of the vinegar. Then the quality of the oil comes through and is worth the expense.

That being pretentiously said, I usually just slosh in ordinary enough virgin oil from Lidl

Hmm. Colin,as ever you say it more eloquently,but ,really,you make the same point as myself.

The vast majority of salads made by the vast majority of us are fairly rustic affairs,and the dressing is designed to give what are essentially bland ingredients a bit of oomph. Thus a vinaigrette,for example, is a fairly strong flavoured condiment,and,as you say just sloshing olive oil in to make it does not require the vast expense of some fancy oil.

I dare say that there are some expert chefs in their field who can create masterpieces as regards salad dressings,but I'd hazard to guess that no member of this forum fits into that category. Certainly not me (or you,by all accounts !)

Helen · Post by **Helen** » Sat 30 Jul 2011 12:27

A couple of thoughts to share:

Since having my wee escape pad in Amelie, I've started to look for local producers of olive oil. (If honest, this was probably fuelled in part by Carol Drinkwater's books where she increasingly fell under the spell of olive oil cultivation and production) It certainly prompted me to find out more about olive oil production in the P.O. and it was interesting to learn that there used to be a lot more cultivation than there is today, but a particularly fierce winter virtually wiped it out.

So far, my attempt to source local oils has only resulted in the purchase of a grand total of two bottles (not out long enough to get through more!) One came from Millas and the most recent from Laroque des Alberes - both were absolutely divine as, when they taste like that, I like nothing better than dipping tasty bread into them. And actually, thinking about the oil/vinegar debate they certainly can complement each other - many a decent restaurant I've been to over the years has served olive oil and balsamic vinegar, along with bread.

One last thought - back in February I was invited to a meal with about 12 of my French neighbours in Amelie. They served up lettuce which had a dressing to die for - it was a million miles from my own sometimes soggy attempts. I reckon I must have eaten the best part of half a lettuce - it was just so tasty! Attempts to find out the 'recipe' failed, but I'm planning another assault on the subject.

john · Post by **john** » Sat 30 Jul 2011 12:41

Helen wrote:One came from Millas and the most recent from Laroque des Alberes - both were absolutely divine as, when they taste like that, I like nothing better than dipping tasty bread into them. .

I'd agree wholeheartedly with that,Helen. Some of the oils we've had for dipping have been great,but then ,as you say the bread seems to compliment them as opposed to overwhelm them as vinegar does. Then it DOES justify the extra expense. But the thread had centred on salad dressings,where that is not the case imho.

For a great range of dipping oils,stay at a Parador in Spain,and you'll get a wonderful selection ,local to that area with your apero,free of charge !

Colin L · Post by **Colin L** » Sat 30 Jul 2011 12:47

john wrote: The vast majority of salads made by the vast majority of us are fairly rustic affairs,and the dressing is designed to give what are essentially bland ingredients a bit of oomph. Thus a vinaigrette,for example, is a fairly strong flavoured condiment,and,as you say just sloshing olive oil in to make it does not require the vast expense of some fancy oil.

I dare say that there are some expert chefs in their field who can create masterpieces as regards salad dressings,but I'd hazard to guess that no member of this forum fits into that category. Certainly not me (or you,by all accounts !)

I confess to buying and sloshing in ordinary oil as a matter of laziness: there is no saying what heights of culinary excellence I would scale if I bought really good olive oil and paid attention to the matter.

I stick to the importance of balance: get it right and a particularly special oil should make a particularly special dressing in the same way as they say an ordinary red makes coq au vin ordinary whereas a really good one makes it special.

I know one Frenchman who deplores the making of a vinaigrette with olive oil in the first place.

And finally, why can't you get white wine vinegar in France?
Or mayonnaise without mustard in it?

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Speaking About Virgins

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